errolston
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Re: Discussion Thread for Bull of the Year 2014
I am not saying Mogul is a bad bull. I just think that the industry as a whole got a bit carried away with him and he got used too much as a sire of sons and maternal grand sire. Now the breed is saturated with his blood which isn't really bringing any improvements to health traits. Although he is an excellent calving ease bull.
I milk a couple. One was one of my highest classified heifers last year and has a beautiful udder. She does leak milk a little.
Her full sister is a great producer but her tailhead is really inset. She has been quite a problem to get pregnant.
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8/5/2016, 11:29
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bazza20
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Re:
Agree. I'm fine with him being used as a sire of sons but the amount of use he got was way over the top.
People have short memories with the Holstein been while some mogul blood can have some benifits too much is a step backwards in my opinion.
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9/5/2016, 0:39
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AmandaS101
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Re:
If you feel he's being used too much chose another bull. There are many bulls out there that contain no Mogul blood.
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9/5/2016, 1:58
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errolston
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Re: Discussion Thread for Bull of the Year 2014
Thanks for the advice. You know I actually worked out that for myself.
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9/5/2016, 10:20
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Blackwalnut
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Re: Discussion Thread for Bull of the Year 2014
I can't agree that Mogul got used too much, the next 10,000 bulls are just a DNA test away. It's a new world out there.
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9/5/2016, 15:36
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KINGMAMBO
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Re: Discussion Thread for Bull of the Year 2014
A great percentage of the Mogul sons look garbage because most of these sons come from mating's that do not compliment Mogul one bit u would be better of using Mogul himself through solid mating's.
This seems to be a problem with Genomic selection a bull comes of age were he can produce sons so off the studs go creating many sons.The problem is are there any decent mating's out there at the time when bulls like Mogul are being used to make sons if there are not don't use him at this stage.It would make far more sense to only use a bull for making sons when there are plenty of daughters from a bull that should compliment the bull being used to make sons.If the studs had waited to use Mogul just a few years later there could be even better Mogul son on the market today with more balance and more use.
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9/5/2016, 17:08
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bazza20
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Re: Re:
quote: AmandaS101 wrote:
If you feel he's being used too much chose another bull. There are many bulls out there that contain no Mogul blood.
Haha. Yeah thanks never thought of that.
It's more that other good bulls don't get the opportunity to contrubute and improve the breed and their genetics are basically lost from the breed.
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9/5/2016, 23:06
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bazza20
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Re: Discussion Thread for Bull of the Year 2014
quote: KINGMAMBO wrote:
A great percentage of the Mogul sons look garbage because most of these sons come from mating's that do not compliment Mogul one bit u would be better of using Mogul himself through solid mating's.
This seems to be a problem with Genomic selection a bull comes of age were he can produce sons so off the studs go creating many sons.The problem is are there any decent mating's out there at the time when bulls like Mogul are being used to make sons if there are not don't use him at this stage.It would make far more sense to only use a bull for making sons when there are plenty of daughters from a bull that should compliment the bull being used to make sons.If the studs had waited to use Mogul just a few years later there could be even better Mogul son on the market today with more balance and more use.
How could there be a better mogul son by waiting to use mogul as a sire of sons.
There wouldn't be any sons if you wait to use him as a sire of sons.
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9/5/2016, 23:09
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KINGMAMBO
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Re: Discussion Thread for Bull of the Year 2014
Waiting for a bull that fits the bull u want to use as a sire of sons is far better than breeding him to bulls that don't fit him and bulls that don't fit with what's available at that time don't do that well on most occasions.
Mccutchen daughters would of been worth waiting for to use Mogul with to make sons just like Mogul daughters should of been bred to Mccutchen to make sons as these two bulls look made for each other and should of been used together not separated by a pointless generation.
The bull IHG Homerun is a great example of the Mogul line being bred to a Mccutchen daughter he has great balance with the best legs I have seen from the Mogul line a true improvement.
https://www.cdn.ca/query/detail_ge.php?breed=HO&sex=M&country=USA®num=73963354
Another such bull would be SSI Reflector Extra a Mogul Reflector son from a Mccutchen daughter he to has much improved legs over many of the Mogul line sons.
https://www.cdn.ca/query/detail_ge.php?breed=HO&country=840&sex=M®num=3124584690
Many bulls that had extreme height of front end either to much or to little also had bad set of rear legs there are many examples of this just like Mogul improving his height of front end may help his rear legs.A bull that has all the assets to improve Mogul is Seaver who has great legs strength and a solid rump Seaver also has a VG87 Pasen Marsh sister.
On paper some of the best bulls that should work well with Mogul don't even come from the same breed there are many Jersey bulls that look better options for Mogul than many Holsteins with bulls like Rock Ella Impression.
Last edited by KINGMAMBO, 10/5/2016, 0:55
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10/5/2016, 0:50
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Outside
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Re: Discussion Thread for Bull of the Year 2014
quote: bazza20 wrote:
quote: KINGMAMBO wrote:
A great percentage of the Mogul sons look garbage because most of these sons come from mating's that do not compliment Mogul one bit u would be better of using Mogul himself through solid mating's.
This seems to be a problem with Genomic selection a bull comes of age were he can produce sons so off the studs go creating many sons.The problem is are there any decent mating's out there at the time when bulls like Mogul are being used to make sons if there are nnot don't use him at this stage.It would make far more sense to only use a bull for making sons when there are plenty of daughters from a bull that should compliment the bull being used to make sons.If the studs had waited to use Mogul just a few years later there could be even better Mogul son on the market today with more balance and more use.
How could there be a better mogul son by waiting to use mogul as a sire of sons.
There wouldn't be any sons if you wait to use him as a sire of sons.
It's been a while since we had some classic king mambo gibberish . I know what he is getting at but we would have to live in parallel universe before it happens . You mate the highest number bull to the highest number heifer then repeat that's breeding I'm afraid.
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10/5/2016, 6:56
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