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Foundations of the Modern Holstein


Here are the health traits of some of the most influential bulls of the genomic era. a bit mixed at best.

Is the breed really making progress for health traits?

Long-Langs Oman Oman
PL -0.4
Scc 3.0
DPR +1.4
Livibility -1.2

Ensenada Taboo Planet
PL 4.6
SCC [sign in to see URL]
DPR -1.3
Liviblity +3.8

Mountfield SSI DCY Mogul
PL +4.1
SCC [sign in to see URL]
DPR -0.2
Livibility -3.9

Roylane Socra Robust
PL +6.6
SCC [sign in to see URL]
DPR +1.5
Livibility +4.0

Bacon-Hill Montross
PL +5.2
SCC [sign in to see URL]
DPR +1.0
Livibility -1.2

Some extra analysis added to my original post:

Seagull-Bay Supersire
PL +6.8
SCC [sign in to see URL]
DPR -0.2
Livibility +1.8

De-Su Bookem
PL +4.6
SCC [sign in to see URL]
DPR +0.6
Livibility +0.3

Amighetti Numero Uno
PL +8.0
SCC [sign in to see URL]
DPR +1.9
Livibility +0.3

Last edited by errolston, 25/9/2017, 13:12
23/9/2017, 19:01 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re: Foundations of the Modern Holstein


Yes.

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24/9/2017, 6:57 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re: Foundations of the Modern Holstein


Man O Man flattered to deceive.

Planets might not be the most fertile cows, but they are as tough as nails and are making old bones, even in New Zealand whose proving system gives no quarter to Overseas bulls, he is -4.4 for Fertility, but has a Total Longevity figure of 214 days and one of the highest Residual Survival BVs of 279 days based on 1308 daughters in that country. His sons Plan and Pluto have stellar health trait figures in that country, doesn't hurt that they are both out of Oman dams. Shamrock smokes on the health traits as do his sons and grandsons. Planet is a plus in any pedigree.

Mogul is a so so health traits bull, but has sired stellar health trait sons. He will go down as one of the most successful sires of sons of all time.

I was a complete Montross skeptic until I saw the daughters in May this year - whoever thought we could get a bull over 3000 Milk that is +1 DPR. The next golden cross is Montross x Numero Uno.

Robust figures speak for themselves. Truly the keystone sire of the modern commercial cow.

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24/9/2017, 7:16 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re: Foundations of the Modern Holstein


SCC is the one trait that really bothers me. In hindsight we were spoilt by Oman, Shottle & Goldwyn who were all outstanding bulls for SCC. It seems to me that this is a legacy squandered. Of all the traits this insofar as SCC is a proxy for mastitis resistance, in my opinion, has the most impact on farmers' profitability.

I agree with you on Planet's legacy through Shamrock and Bookem would be another strong transmitter.

I am not so sure about your Mogul comments. What stellar health traits sons has Mogul produced? Until his sons have had daughters milking for a significant length of time then I think it is too early to be able to make such a statement with any confidence.

My motivation for this thread was the deterioration over time of Planet, Man-O-Man and Mogul's health traits. These bulls have all been hugely influential in the genomic era but when their own health traits were higher. Can we really trust foundations of the genomic era if these bulls were overrated in the first place? Haven't we just lucked out in gaining some high health trait bulls in the early stages of genomics. These early bulls have had Oman or Ramos close up. Pine-Tree Missy family is based on a Rudolph, with Mandingo (a Bootmaker grand son) further back.

Shamrock is out of a Shottle with a Rudolph further back. Plan and Pluto both have Oman dams. Bookem is from a Ramos.
25/9/2017, 9:45 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re: Foundations of the Modern Holstein


So I did a little homework this morning and found 98 Mogul sons with a production reliability of 86 and above.

They average
966 MilK
99 CFP
[sign in to see URL] PL
-1.2 Livability
[sign in to see URL] SCS
[sign in to see URL] DPR
6.8 Calving Ease
132 Feed Efficiency
[sign in to see URL] UDC
[sign in to see URL] FLC

If that is not breed progress, then what is?

His top PL sons are: Fix, Troy, Delta, Multiply, Rubicon, Main Event, Muscadet and Reflector ranging from 8.2 to 6.6 PL

His top DPR sons: Troy, Altaroble, Delta, Main Event, Reflector Mardi Gras, Multiply, Tampa, Discovery, Tallyho Milkshake all over +3DPR

His sons [sign in to see URL] SCS average speaks for itself, of the 98 on my list 19 are worse than breed average. Uptown is the lowest at [sign in to see URL] SCS

Livability is his Achilles heel.

For the record my highest selling Mogul son by far has been Mookie, then Multiply, Fairfax and Tallyho.

Last edited by smous, 26/9/2017, 5:54


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26/9/2017, 5:31 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re: Foundations of the Modern Holstein


Genomics definitely finds elite health trait bulls, my top selling genomic bull this season is +770 Milk, +87 CFP, +[sign in to see URL], +[sign in to see URL], +[sign in to see URL], +[sign in to see URL], 4.9 CE, [sign in to see URL], [sign in to see URL]

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26/9/2017, 5:39 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re: Foundations of the Modern Holstein


smous 2 questions, who is the above mentioned health trait bull, and did you see any milking mookies when you were in the states. I have used a fair swag but the oldest are only 6mths or so

26/9/2017, 12:26 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re: Foundations of the Modern Holstein


SSI Hotshot Snazzy-ET

Saw all manner of Mogul sons daughters on our trip: Montross, Yoder, Pety, Gambler, Chops, Multiply, one Hartford but no Mookies. Couple of months later the WWS New Zealand guys saw a bunch of Mookie daughters including these five. Locally Mookies are calving in thick and fast, they are sturdy and good uddered.

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27/9/2017, 5:08 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re:


Cheers, saw the report from the NZ boys was just curious for your opinion as linear doesn't scream the width and robustness that the kiwi boys saw, I didn't see any photo's though. It would appear that I may have used him a little wrong if those 5 are representative.

In regards to Snazzy does the 95 for milking speed on CDN concern you?
27/9/2017, 13:12 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 
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Re:


What is the Canadian standard deviation? 5?

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27/9/2017, 15:15 Link to this post PM via Email   PM via Forum
 


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