shilt79
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Classification Results
On July 1st, we (myself - Scott Hilt & Aaron Lancaster) started milking cows at Goldcrest Holsteins in Lynden, Washington with the purchase of the 30 cow Elainedale herd, coupled with our own Family Hill herd, and several other elite individuals from throughout the US. On November 18th, we had our first classification. It was a great success, with 10 new EX cows, making for a total of 21 EX (2 @ 93, 5 @ 92, 8 @ 91, and 6 @ 90), 17 VG (including 6 new VG 2 yr olds), and the remainder GP81 or better. We scored a total of 48 cows, and the herd size totals 55 cows (seven were NIC-ed, due to just fresh, or dry).
Some of my favorite highlights of the day:
Encore Tiffany EX-92 EX92 MS @ 4-08, just 6 weeks fresh with her 2nd calf. Dam is a VG Integrity, Tiffany was nominated All-American Jr. 2 yr old in 2002.
Encore Venum EX93 EX95 MS @ 4-11. Her dam is a GP Counselor. We have a very nice Jan. 04 Rubens dtr.
Raider Alisha EX93 EX93 MS, scored at 10 yrs. of age, and 7 calves; her Encore dtr. went EX90. She also has a Jubilant Sept. calf.
Mark Rosa EX92 EX92 MS, she has been a 4 time All-WA winner in milking form for us! She has a Gibson heifer.
Skybuck Dream EX92 EX92 MS, just 5 days fresh; she is out of an EX94 Startmore Supreme.
Encore Roxanne EX90, her dam is Tony Roxie EX92, then Roxette EX 30*, and her third dam is Roxy EX97 herself.
Stardust Laia VG88 EX90 MS @ 2-10, she is out of an EX Broker that was Nominated All American Sr. 2 yr old, and also was 1st Intermediate Calf at the Royal in 1992.
Durham Cora EX92 EX93 MS @ 3-08, her dam is an EX Lartist. She made over 36,000 lbs of milk 3x as a two year old. She is +1550 CTPI, and has contract interest.
Storm Elway EX91, out of a VG Loyal; her BW Marshall dtr. went EX90, and her Durham aunt went EX90. All three cows were above +1500 CTPI Aug. proof.
Sally EX92 EX92 MS, this is an interesting one! We found her in Idaho, and she is by a Lindy x Starbuck herd bull. Her maternal sire stack is: Lindy x Raider x Tempo x Astronaut. The same day we bought another cow in that herd, Salty EX91. She is by a Milan x Raider herd bull. Her maternal sire stack is: Broker x Starbuck x Tempo x Banner x Star x Elevation x Marquis. Both cow’s families are bred by the same people in ID for over 50 years. Yet, most all of them do not have records, or classifications. They were purchased as 3 yr olds, and now are both on their third lactation.
This is a very exciting start for us. I am working on a website, and we are working on getting cows pictured, so hopefully we'll be able to show everyone what we have!
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23/11/2004, 1:36
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Bullpen
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Re: Classification Results
"Encore Tiffany EX-92 EX92 MS @ 4-08, just 6 weeks fresh with her 2nd calf. Dam is a VG Integrity, Tiffany was nominated All-American Jr. 2 yr old in 2002."
I remember her. Wasn't she at Silvamoon- out of an Hilmar cow? Congratulations nice cow!
Is Durham Cora from Diamond eves corrie family? You must tell us more about your families, they sound very interesting. Hope you are mating them to some decent bulls.
Thought you lacked some balanced bulls with a bit of production to take these sort of pedigrees to the next level in your "Whats in the tank" string. Not that you should take any notice of me (I know you have a fine record representing Modesto at Madison and Louisville), but you don't have anything approaching the likes of Durham & BW Marshall other than Storm, Mark & September in your flask. They look like a list from a show clippers tank not a serious breeder!
Look at the diversity of bulls your local man at Markwell has used to develop his families. Do yourself a favour and get some Sam or Modest or Blitz or even Shottle or Titanic and you may get a broader appeal.
Good luck to you, whatever you decide.
Last edited by Bullpen, 23/11/2004, 10:52
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23/11/2004, 9:21
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shilt79
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Re: Classification Results
Bullpen, here are the answers to your question:
Yes, the Encore Tiffany cow was at Silvamoon, and I think she has more points in her this lactation yet. We bought her dry and very fat, this summer!
As far as the Durham Cora cow goes, we picked her up out of a commercial herd recently. She was milking 3x 155 lbs/day on her second calf, and her dam is an EX Lartist (one of his first crop dtrs, she was advertised a fair bit). After that, it's a GP, then a couple VG's. It isn't the Corrie family, however we did buy a couple of Durham embryos out of the good Charles at Carnation at their dispersal, so hopefully we get a female from that family.
As far as our semen tank list looking like:
quote:
a list from a show clippers tank not a serious breeder!
Thanks for the vote of confidence. Two of the cows listed were actually bred by us, the Encore Venum cow, and Skybuck Dream. I'm sorry if you don't have the same philosophy as we do, but we graze (with some alfalfa hay and grass baleage for supplement) in the spring/summer, and in the fall/winter we feed alfalfa hay, baleage, and grass silage and our grain is in the parlor. We've found those bulls do fine for us as far as production goes. In fact, our tank average has been at 80 lbs, give or take 3 lbs, pretty much since July 1.
As far as looking at the local man at Markwell to get an idea of what bulls to use, I'd rather not! The slow degradation of type in that herd has sped up in recent times. He has now stacked too many bulls on top of each other that lack both the type, and strength and capacity. He's all about fads and fashion now. Does nothing for himself and everything for the studs and the market. I worked there for five years, and in the early years, we calved in dtrs of Jed, Astre, Mandel, etc. typically from pedigrees heavy with Blackstar, Mark, Mars Tony, and Elevation. They were high VG two yr olds that milked well, and just got better and better. I went to school for two years like you've mentioned. Then after returning for two more years of work, I did not like the changing direction/philosophy of the herd. He had used Convincer, Durham, BW Marshall heavily. One of the things he had prided himself on, was prior to those bulls, that there was almost no, or very little, Bell in the herd's bloodlines. And much of the good type was attributed to that.
So now, after seeing dtrs of all those bulls calve in a couple yrs later, and the number of discarded two year olds, due to type, I became quite sick about things. I would dare bet, of the first 20 dtrs of Durham to calve, half were sold due to below average type, and some have quite prolific sisters. Most all the BW Marshall's were sold, and the Convincers actually did well. My point is, prior to that, we had not done that. We weeded two year olds, here and there, but those bulls made it ridiculous. After that, I decided that this was not for me. I loved breeding cows, and working with them too much to see two years hard work go down the drain when they calve in. And so, I quit.
I think there is lessons in it. Do you have to use the bulls the studs and markets tell you to, to be popular and fashionable? Yes I think so. Do I care to be popular and fashionable? No, not one damn bit! Are bulls like Durham, BW Marshall, and Convincer bad bulls? Certainly not, but they're not for me. Can I be profitable milking good typed cattle for myself, and selling genetics? You bet, we have started it already!
I can tell you one thing, from working as fitter at tons of sale from one side of the US to the other, as well as in Canada, and in Germany as well; and that is - type sells. It doesn't matter what bull a heifer is sired by, if it's wrapped in a nice and pretty package (good type) it will sell for more money. It's that simple. Straight hard tops, flat wide rumps, good rib, nice legs, and dairy strength in a calf will always attract people, it's just the way it is.
Bullpen, I hope I've shed some light on what it is we're doing, and why we're doing it this way. I won't be rushing out for Durham anytime soon. I hated milking the crabby things at Markwell, and I'd rather buy a couple here and there that I know have the type and temperament I want. As far as Sam, I think there will be a better Durham son coming, so I'll hold out. We are using one as a y.s. Durham x Lincoln Bonnie EX96. B-l-i-t-z, that five letter word should be P-l-a-i-n. They may milk well, and have functional type, but they are not my type of cow, are void of that little thing called style, and have bad components. We've used Titanic some, now it's wait and see. Personally I don't think they have the strength and capacity, but he was used on extreme cows. Shottle, he's not easy to get, I don't like the sire stack, and I can't see dtrs. Modest, the two dtr. pics look good, his linear is nice, but his components scare me and quite frankly, I'd rather wait to see what those rumps and rear legs look like.
Well after babbling on, I've realized I've typed a lot, so I hope that helps you understand what Goldcrest is about.
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23/11/2004, 17:16
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Bullpen
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Re: Classification Results
Thanks for your honest appraisal Scott. I like your answers and you argue your case well. I was probably too blunt in my comments and I admire your restraint.
I must say I am saddened to hear of the demise at Markwell. I was hoping to get out there soon to have a look but maybe the long journey would disappoint.
I still think everyone needs an injection of dairy every so many generations to keep the type going and no doubt you have bulls in mind to serve this purpose.
Good luck to you.
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23/11/2004, 18:02
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shilt79
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Re: Classification Results
Bullpen, I don't want to mislead you about the Markwell herd. It is a great herd. It is just changing from what it used to be. That is the type of cattle that his father, Marv, bred had the capacity, framework, good udders, and production. Now it's more "modern" cattle for lack of better words. Nothing wrong with that, just if you had seen them 5 or 6 yrs. ago it was truly a site. It would still be well worth the visit. He has a lot of ET's every year, so he is able to dispose of poorer females - which makes for a nice display.
As far as that injection of dairyness......that is something we are always looking for, it's just tough to find a bull that satisfies us in that regard. Titanic, Sept Storm, a little Champion, and hopefully a Durham son in the future will do this.
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23/11/2004, 18:14
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Bullpen
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Re: Classification Results
Scott,
I was talking to a neighbour of yours tonight called Randy Kortus from Mainstream holsteins and Jerseys.
He was a guest speaker at our local holstein Club here in Shropshire, England. Seems to have a very high yielding herd with some great looking individuals.He has bred lots of 200,000 and 7 x 300,000lb cows.
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24/11/2004, 0:54
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classcow
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Re: Classification Results
Scott - COngrats on a successful classification. SOunds like an outstanding group that you have put together. You also sound like the rest of us wanting more points. 92 with 2 calves is huge!! Hard- or nearly impossible- to get more than 92 without more calves.
Bullpen - I was at Kortus' abotu a year ago and was very disappointed. A few nice cows but he liked his high indexing cows rather than his high type long lasting cows. He struck me as the type to toot his own horn. I wondered about his records as the bunk was empty, the feet were sore and they did not look like 35,000 pound cows. Just my opinion. He does have a few nice cows there.
Sorry to hear Markwell has gone the index way. I was there on the same tour and was very impressed. Mark was very open about selling many of the lesser desirable animals as they do have so many ET calves born every year. He had a great herd of cows. I hope he can continue to breed from what he has.
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24/11/2004, 4:52
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CHARITY
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Re: Classification Results
The Leader sister to my heifer has just been scored EX in Canada i hope the Allen turns out this good at 4 years of age.
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3/12/2004, 11:55
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